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Page 12 TODD BLANCHE: So -- okay. So that's how you meet him. So we -- and again I don't want to spend a lot of time, you know, on -- on this particular issue, but what happened with your relationship over the years, from the time you meet him in 1991, up until the time he -- he passed away? DAVID MARKUS: Just give the highlights. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Okay, the highlights. So I I was looking for real estate for my dad to buy some, and Epstein told me that he was also looking to move from his apartment and would I help him? And I I said, sure I'm looking already so could look for him. So that's how it started. And then, in 1991, my father passed away and I returned to New York after that, originally to come back and help with the family businesses, which was McMillan. And then the debacle of my father's passing hit the family. And -- and we lost all our businesses and my family thought that it would be t 4 I stayed in America, because of the intensity the press and the drama surrounding my father's th in England So I stayed and Epstein said, well, you can keep helping me. You can help me find a house and MAGNA®© LEGAL SERVICES DOJ-OGR-00022404