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on TIMA OB WN TE Page 42 government, either state or federal, subpoena your bank records or subpoena anything from your financial life, during that time? During the -- that time? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: No. Not as far as I'm aware. Now, if they did, I don't know it and I have -- [have no idea about that, to be honest. But I'm -- I'm not aware of it and I would say no, but maybe you guys do things that I don't know. TODD BLANCHE: So how did -- how did you learn of that case? When Mr. Epstein was arrested, or did you know that something was happening before then? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: The -- the first thing I knew was he had told me he was deciding to redecorate the house in Palm Beach. It didn't surprise me, it was like a rolling situation. TODD BLANCHE: And, but by that time are you doing -- are you -- like he tells you because he wants your help or your relationship changed by this time where you were no longer kind of acting his -- as his general manager? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: No. I was -- I was still around. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I wasn't gone. I was Page 43 Or~ATIN OF WNP DH WAAIHDHO PWN FP Nh BD +t ro Ww with Ted. I was traveling. I wasn't daily -- 1f you would ask me where he was in any given time, I'm not sure I would've known then. I mean, it was, I -- I felt like I suppose the relationship moved into sort of like a long-term friend-family, you know, like -- TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- like I felt he had with Eva, if I'm honest. TODD BLANCHE: Yeah. Okay. So -- so he says to you he's going to redecorate the Palm Beach house. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: He -- he asked me specifically which decorator he thinks I -- he should use, because I had a lot of contacts with decorators and he was not very good with people. He was useless at maintaining relationships with people who worked for him, I'm not. So anyways, I recommended -- I think recommended. I can't be a hundred percent sure, because it's been a long time, but I think I recommended Mark Zeff at that time. TODD BLANCHE: Who? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Mark Zeff -- TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- I believe. And I don't know why. I -- I don't remember. That's all oO TN OA PWN EE RRR NFO wo MAGNA®© Page 44 lost to time. But anyway, at some point, I think his mother had died now. I can't remember the timing of all of that either. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: But I ended up in Palm Beach and he had asked me to come and look at the swatches or whatever he was doing, because they had laid it all out over the house and various things, and I think he'd asked for my opinion. That's my memory of this. It may also be that Ted and I were going to Palm Beach, because Ted had a golf match or something. There was a reason I was in Palm Beach. It wasn't solely -- I don't -- maybe that’s not true either. I don't know. So I -- TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- there's a, you know, sometimes I went to Palm Beach because Ted was there. I don't know if that's part of that time -- TODD BLANCHE: Go ahead -- go ahead. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- or Ted went there and left me. I don't know, something. Anyway, I was there. No. That's not how that went either. No. Anyway, at some point in that time, I saw all the swatches, at some point in 2005, Page 45 I think that was. And then I believe, or I don't remember. I -- I think I got a phone call actually. I wasn't in Palm Beach. I think I got a phone call that there was a police at his house or something. There was a -- TODD BLANCHE: And would you have gotten a phone call from him or you think you were just told by somebody that knew that it had happened or don't -- or don't you remember? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Definitely not him. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I think it would've been the houseman. TODD BLANCHE: So when that happens, whenever it was, that's kind of the first time you know that Mr. Epstein's being investigated for -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I -- I didn't even know what that -- I didn't even understand. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I didn't have a context for that. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: It was like, I didn't even know -- J -- I didn't know. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. So after -- 12 (Pages 42 to 45) LEGAL SERVICES DOJ-OGR- 00022667