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ODr~wAnA OAR WNHeRF OCW WAIN OO PWN PB Page 166 Thursday, July 24th. And the recording device is now on. TODD BLANCHE: So when we stopped to take a break, we were talking about what has been publicly discussed as a black book or the Epstein list. And that’s where we are. So you said you think you might know or that you're aware of kind of the origin of this narrative. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Right. I just want to reiterate again, there is no list that I am aware of. I've never, at any time, at least during the period of time when I was -- TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- present. The origin of this story, I believe, begins -- or it has a beginning in 2009, and then it has a prequel but we have to start in 2009. In 2009, there is -- Epstein is, I think, out of jail, and there are civil suits taking place. Many of these are coming out of a disgraced law firm, Rothstein Adler -- Rothstein, Rosenfeldt & Adler. At that law firm is a lawyer who started there in April, May, 2009, called Brad Edwards. In 2009, allegedly the FBI gets a call in October of Page 167 2009 from Brad Edwards, and he allegedly tells them that he has come across a piece of evidence that belongs to Epstein, that contains a list of all of his clients and victims, underage girls, massage therapists, and his -- and the men who are having sex with them. And he becomes -- he, Brad Edwards becomes a cooperating witness -- cooperating -- LEAH SAFFIAN: Confidential. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- confidential informant, sorry. Confidential informant for them. And in a sting operation obtains the list from a former butler of Epstein's called Alfredo Rodriguez. And it becomes evidence in the civil suit. In the -- Alfredo Rodriguez is subsequently prosecuted for having an AK-47 or something weird, some guns or something, and goes to trial. And there's a criminal complaint that the FBI produced. And tn that criminal complaint, it says that Brad Edwards became aware of the list, but -- we'll call it the list for the purposes of this. After Alfredo Rodriguez's two depositions that are held in Epstein's civil suit. It's in the FBI's affidavit that the oO TN OA PF WN EF NPRPRPRPRPRPRP RPP RB OO MITA URWNHE Ow BANOO BFWNHRrF OO WMAATHD OB WN EP NO NM ND +t Nr Ow Page 168 evidence was collected, and Brad Edwards became aware of it after the second deposition. It's in the criminal complaint. The truth is different from what's in both the criminal complaint and in that FBI affidavit, and in Brad Edward's own statements on the subject. The truth is that Alfredo Rodriguez was deposed twice, once in July and once in August. And in the July deposition, told Brad Edwards that he had handwritten notes or a journal, whatever, in the deposition. And Brad Edwards replies, well, we're going to come back for a second deposition. And the second deposition takes place in August. What this means is that Brad Edwards had access to the list from sometime between July and August, until when he actually called the FBI in October. So we're talking six months or so. Rothstein's firm was raided a few days after the list went into the FBI's hands, and, subsequently, Rothstein himself was prosecuted for RICO, and I believe went to jail for 50 years. As part of that RICO case, he admitted to, on the record, and was -- I don't know whether he was prosecuted for creating fake settlements and fake Page 169 evidence in Epstein's case. In 2009, simultaneously whilst this was going on, my boyfriend, Ted Waitt, was asked for $10 million to keep me out of any of Epstein's civil suits. Up until then, I had not been in any of Epstein's civil suits. In fact, I wasn't even sure, save for the first time I was mentioned was by eile | hadn't been -- I was basically nowhere. And then Ted was called for this $10 million and had been shown -- his people had been shown evidence that included the list, the flight logs and various other pieces of evidence. Now, we're going to the prequel part of this story, so then it can tie to how this starts. In 2007, Epstein signs the non-prosecution agreement. He then fights the prosecution agreement or debates it through the DOJ or whatever happened there, and 1s -- goes to the court in 2008, when it's accepted or whatever that is. Villafana was the lead prosecutor or the lead -- yes, in that case. And she, I think, was not happy or with the outcome and utilized, at that time, Brad Edwards, to file the CVRA case. Now, what 1s -- what I have managed to understand from this is, within the OPR itself, there MAGNA® 43 (Pages 1606 to 169) LEGAL SERVICES DOJ-OGR- 00022698