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Page 257 Mr. Epstein's plane? Again, I'm not holding you to exact, but -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: That was a full, that was packed. Because it was a lot of secret service. Tt took all th Secret Service as well. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: So it was whatever the detail is for Secret Service, it's a lot. TODD BLANCHE: And on how many occasions, besides the trip you just described, were there other times when they used -- when President Clinton and the folks he was with, used Mr. Epstein's plane? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I think it was -- there was twice, maybe. There was that. But it will flect on the logs. There won't be anything that's on the logs that you have already. TODD BLANCHE: Were you, by the way, responsible for the logs in any way? Like, you've seen the logs and they're public and you have them in discovery. But over the years when you were working for Mr. Epstein, did you have access to the GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I was, not. No, never. The pilots -- the logbook was their personal MAGNA®© LEGAL SERVICES DOJ-OGR-00022800