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on TIMA OB WN TE Page 325 GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Right. That is what I believe today, yes. But given -- if any of the stories are true, even if he had erectile dysfunction, the thing had a priapism, for Christ's sake. TODD BLANCHE: Well, that's -- that's one of the reasons for my questions. I mean, you're right. I mean -- and again, we're -- we've talked about this a fair amount, but what did -- like the stories of what masseuses, underage and overage have said about him is, are, you know, and what he liked, what he demanded that they do. Whether it's watching him masturbate or pinching his nipples, you know, kind of things that are unusual. Do you believe that? Like, do you -- from what you saw, from what you observed, from what you did when you were in a relationship with him, is that true? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I -- well, the bulk of what I read, he did not have sex. So that is consistent with what he told me, actually. And his masturbating, that is also consistent with what I knew myself. And I'm going to use a bad word for -- TODD BLANCHE: Please, you can use Page 326 whatever words you need. Yes. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Blowjob. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: He liked blowjobs. TODD BLANCHE: Okay. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: That I did observe. And he didn't seem to have any erectile dysfunction for blowjobs, but sex, he didn't have. So when I read the stories about all the allegations of sexual rape, I find that challenging, because that was not his modus operandi, from my perspective. TODD BLANCHE: But when you read about blowjobs, that -- does that -- that would be consistent with kind of -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: That would be consistent, as would masturbation, yes. TODD BLANCHE: Did you talk to masseuses or women that either he was in a relationship with or who asked you about working with him? Did you tell them, yes, he likes blowjobs, yes, he'll masturbate in front of you? Like, did you have conversations with any of those -- with women about what Mr. Epstein liked or what would make him happy, or things like that? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I don't have any ABAD OBFWNF OHM WAT HANO B WN EP NM NM NN ND + OF WNFrF OC © onan OB WN TE RoR row Page 327 memory of telling anybody about that. I think I may have joked like saying, oh my God, you know, like from a Sex and the City scene that, you know, he's -- but not -- I never instruct -- the question you're asking me, sorry, let's just be clear. Did I ever instruct anyone how to pleasure, Mr. Epstein, your question? No. TODD BLANCHE: And you said this earlier, but I want to just -- you kind of said it on your own. I want to ask the question, just so I'll make sure that there's no confusion. When -- when you over the years -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Sorry, can I just -- TODD BLANCHE: -- yeah. Of course. Yeah, yeah, please. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: Okay. Right. I just want to say, the idea that I would have to explain to a woman how to satisfy Mr. Epstein is patently absurd, because he clearly was able to explain himself. He didn't need an interlocutor to explain what he liked. He's been doing this obviously or this -- some version of this story his whole life and did not require any help from me. TODD BLANCHE: Then -- so did you ever Page 328 observe him having sex with a masseuse? Regular intercourse, not a blowjob, nothing else, where you either walked in or you were in the room? GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I never saw him have sex with any person. TODD BLANCHE: And so how about oral sex? Did you ever observe a woman giving him oral sex, whether you were in the room or walked in, or -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I never saw anyone give Epstein a blowjob. No. TODD BLANCHE: But you said earlier you did see him masturbating in front of masseuses. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I don't know if I said that. I don't know -- TODD BLANCHE: Okay. Sorry. I don't want -- GHISLAINE MAXWELL: -- if I said that. TODD BLANCHE: Let me ask you a question. Sorry GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I don't know for sure I said that. TODD BLANCHE: No, that's fair. That's fair. GHISLAINE MAXWELL: I said I saw him -- I'm sure I saw him in a -- what some people could MAGNA® °°?" LEGAL SERVICES DOJ-OGR- 00022944