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From: Ari Gesher <ari®gesher.net>
To: Jeffrey Epstein
Subject: Re: MDF
Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2013 01:32:03 +0000
That sounds really interesting - can you explain that a bit more so I can unpack it further? This is venturing into
an area of math that I'm a bit light on.
What exactly are you referring to here? Network defense, immune systems?
On Oct 25, 2013, at 4:49, Jeffrey Epstein <
> wrote:
the topological equivalents I believe show great promise. manifold transformations. just like immediately
knowing that the girl who looks almost like your girlfriend ( twin sister ) isn't. the transform to self is skewed.
On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 8:37 PM, Ari Gesher
wrote:
The adaptive adversaries in the immune syste
asites. I wrote a piece using biological
parasites as a strong analogy for the problems cyber security (which also goes into the need to use side-
channels to find and stop adaptive adversaries). The immune system does a horrible job of dealing with
parasites (definitionally) and can be seen to be just like standard pattern-matching/data mining/statistical
approaches as a defense mechanism - they're really good at stopping what they've seen before and pretty bad
at stopping novel attacks.
The self-recognition piece is interesting, though.
On Oct 23, 2013, at 5:26 PM, Jeffrey Epstein <
> wrote:
I think the immune system might provide useful insights . Recognizing self , attacking everything that is not
self
On Wednesday, October 23, 2013, Ari Gesher wrote:
On Oct 23, 2013, at 8:09 AM, Joscha Bach <
• wrote:
That being said, AGI will have trouble succeeding because it is
following the scruffy tradition. Perhaps the main failing of this
tradition is its refusal to define objective (and preferably
quantitative) measures of success.
The question of good benchmark tasks is haunting Al since its inception. Usually, when we
identify a task that requires intelligence in humans (playing chess or soccer or Jeopardy,
driving a car etc.) we end up with a kind of very smart (chess-playing, car-driving) toaster. That
being said, Al was always very fruitful in the sense that it arguably was the most productive
and useful field of computer science, even if it fell short of its lofty goals. Without a
commitment to understanding intelligence and mind itself, Al as a discipline may be doomed,
because it will lose the cohesion and direction of a common goal.
EFTA00675599
So now this gets interesting and starts to point us towards both MDF and the study of deception.
The smart toasters emerge because they're being designed to solve well-bounded problems (like playing
chess). There is no deception in chess (I would put feints in a different category), no hidden information,
no adaptive adversary that can breach the bounds of the rules of the game. Given that, either brute force
or ML/statistical approaches works well enough to build things like Deep Blue or the Google self-driving
car.
At Palantir (where I work), we have, to date, stayed away from heavy machine learning or algorithmic
approaches to data analysis, focusing instead on building better and better tools to connect human minds
to data in a way that's rigorous and interactive. This is the only current way to detect adaptive adversaries
like sophisticated fraudsters or state-sponsored cyber attackers - traditional ML approaches fail as tactics
adapt faster than training data can be identified, tagged, and learned. I like to think of this class of
problems as arms races, since automation is easily defeated by a change in tactics that use more
advanced/harder to detect techniques.
Let's take a look at fraud. Simple fraud, like stolen credit cards, is solved with simple automation looking
for anomalies inside a big, validated training set (your legitimate transactions). The type of fraud is much
more subtle I'm talking about goes something like this:
1. Open accounts under fake identities
2. Use accounts, pay balances, drive up credit lines
3. Hit magic number, max out all cards
4. Write fake checks to zero balances
5. Max cards a second time before the checks bounce
6. abandon the fake identities
7. Goto step 1
Instead, the state of the art is to use fairly simple data-mining to flag suspicious events with a low-
threshold - yielding a set of candidate events much smaller than the initial haystack but containing a
relatively large number of false positives. In the above example, we use clustering that looks at caller ID
data for calls to the bank, card transactions, payment methods, IP address data for access to the website,
and account details. Seemingly unrelated accounts that are linked are scored by aggregate credit risk and
queued up for human analysis in a rich, interactive analytic environment. This is how the final
determination of fraud is made. The magic of our software is not magic at all - we integrate the data
across multiple, disparate sources of data into a human-conceptual model based on a constrained
ontology of the problem at hand. The interface is interactive (sometimes requiring some pretty serious
engineering to pull off) and speaks a language that is familiar to the human experts on the problem,
enabling them to move through large volumes of data very quickly. (For a simple but demonstrative
workflow, take a look at this cybersecurity demo)
Our newest innovation is letting the human analysts specify the pattern matching algorithms in this
ontologically-typed language (Conceptually: "two credit card accounts used at the same store to buy the
same item within three minutes of each other") that is then translated into search jobs on the map-reduce
cluster. This allows for a tight feedback loop and hopefully stay ahead of the fraudsters.
What I've been noodling on is using a mix of MDF (these institutions fighting fraud are often combing
through terabytes of data produced per day) and deep learning to see if you could train classifiers that
would not only spot fraud but be able to see it as their tactics change.
It's sort of an interesting twist on the Turing Test: can an Al detect the signature of a human that's actively
trying to evade detection?
EFTA00675600
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EFTA00675601
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| Filename | EFTA00675599.pdf |
| File Size | 226.6 KB |
| OCR Confidence | 85.0% |
| Has Readable Text | Yes |
| Text Length | 7,465 characters |
| Indexed | 2026-02-11T23:28:11.018332 |