EFTA00117078.pdf

1 2 3 4 DIGITALLY RECORDED 5 SWORN STATEMENT 6 OF 7 8 9 OIG CASE #: 10 2019-010614 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE 19 OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL 20 AUGUST 5, 2021 21 22 23 24 25 RESOLUTE DOCUMENTATION SERVICES 28632 Roadside Drive, Suite 285 Agoura Hills, CA 91301 Phone: (818) 431-5800 EFTA00117078 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 APPEARANCES: 2 3 OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR GENERAL 4 BY: 5 BY: 6 7 8 WITNESS: 9 10 11 12 OTHER APPEARANCES: 13 NONE 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 EFTA00117079 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 2 name is : The recorder is on. My , and I'm a senior 3 3 special agent with the U.S. Department of 4 Justice, Office of the Inspector General, New 5 York Field Office, and these are my 6 credentials. 7 : Okay. 8 : And this interview with 9 Federal Bureau of Prisons employee S'amar 10 is being conducted as part of an 11 official U.S. Department of Justice, Office of 12 the Inspector General investigation. Today's 13 date is August 5, 2021, and the time is 1:49 14 p.m. This interview is being conducted at the 15 Metropolitan Correctional Center, located in 16 New York, New York. Also present is DOJ/OIG 17 Special Agent . This interview 18 will be recorded by me, Special Agent - or 19 Senior Special Agent - 20 Could everyone please identify themselves for 21 the record, and spell their last name? To 22 start, again, I am DOJ/OIG Senior Special Agent 23 24 MR. : This is DOJ/OIG Special 25 Agent, . The last name is D-A-N- EFTA00117080 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 I-E-L. Here is my credentials. 2 : Okay. My name is officer 3 with the Federal Bureau of Prisons. 4 Last name . And these are 5 my credentials. 6 : You got your credentials 7 this time. Wow. Fancy. All right. 8 MR. : Thank you. 9 : Thank you. I am looking 10 at a picture, which it does match the person 11 sitting in front of me. This is an official 12 DOJ investigation into the death of inmate 13 Jeffrey Epstein and the surrounding 14 circumstances, and you are being asked to 15 voluntarily provide answers to our questions. 16 Will you agree to a voluntary interview with 17 the DOJ/OIG? 18 : Sure. 19 : All right. And there's a 20 form that we - and we just interviewed you, 21 just shortly, you know, a short time ago - but 22 it's the same form. It says, United States 23 Department of Justice, Office of the Inspector 24 General, Warnings and Assurances to Employee 25 Requested to Provide Information on a Voluntary EFTA00117081 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 Basis. "You are being asked to provide 2 information as part of an investigation being 3 conducted by the Office of the Inspector 4 General. This investigation is being conducted 5 pursuant to the Inspector General Act of 1978, 6 as amended. This investigation pertains to job 7 performance failure and security failure. This 8 is a voluntary interview. Accordingly, you do 9 not have to answer questions. No disciplinary 10 action will be taken against you if you choose 11 not to answer questions. Any statements you 12 furnish may be used as evidence in any future 13 criminal proceedings, or agency disciplinary 14 proceedings, or both." And there's a waiver 15 section. It says, "I understand the Warnings 16 and Assurances stated above and I am willing to 17 make a statement and answer questions. No 18 promises or threats have been made to me, and 19 no pressure or coercion of any kind has been 20 used against me." You want to take a look? 21 Again, it's the same form from before, but if 22 you agree, there's an employee signature, and 23 an employee's name, where you print. 24 Mm-hmm. Okay. 25 : Thank you very much for EFTA00117082 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 6 1 signing and printing your name. Today's date 2 is - again - 8/5/21, and the time is 3 MR. : 1:52 p.m. 4 : 1:52 p.m. We are at 5 the MCC, New York. And I'm signing my name. 6 Again, this is . And I'm 7 printing. Here you go, Special Agent 8 MR. : This is . I'm 9 signing on the signature of witness. 10 : Did you understand the 11 OIG form? 12 : Yes. 13 : Thank you. Before 14 starting the interview, I'd like to place you 15 under oath. can you please raise 16 your right hand? Do you swear to tell the truth 17 and nothing but the truth during this 18 interview? 19 : Yes, I do. 20 : Great. Were you 21 previously interviewed by the OIG in August ci 22 2019, and then again, by myself and SA 23 this past month, in July of 2021? 24 : Yes. I was. 25 : All right. And you EFTA00117083 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 7 1 already showed me your credentials, so I don't 2 need to ask you this background stuff. Are you 3 currently employed by the BOP? 4 : Yes. 5 : And what is your current 6 position with the BOP? 7 : Receiving and Discharge. 8 Correctional Systems Officer. 9 : Is there any change since 10 the last time we spoke to you? 11 : No. 12 : Great. All right. So, 13 this is just a supplemental interview. When we 14 spoke last, you talked about some different 15 documentation that we could potentially obtain 16 in order to clear up some of the things we were 17 looking at. Specifically, we were looking into 18 Efrain Reyes. And when he was released, and 19 what would have been put on the court list. 20 The court transfer. So, when we last spoke, we 21 talked about this daily log. This, I'm going 22 to show you. It's from 8/9/2019. And on the 23 third page, where I've highlighted, it says 24 Reyes was pre-removed at 0838, when you had 25 mentioned, during our interview, that you can't EFTA00117084 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 8 1 tell exactly why he was removed at that point, 2 just that, if he's listed as pre-removed, it 3 was highly unlikely that he would have been 4 returned, and it was assumed that he was 5 leaving the MCC, for good. Is that correct? 6 : That is correct. 7 : All right. Great. So, 8 there is that, in case you wanted to look at 9 it. So, we went back, and we found these 10 emails. And so, this is just the first email 11 that we found was, this was from a Sampson 12 Choo, C-H-O-O, from the U.S. Marshal Service. 13 : Okay. 14 : And this was to, it looks 15 like - I'm assuming all of R&D, as well as 16 yourself. 17 : Mm-hmm. 18 : And then, it says, the 19 subject, "Transfer of Prisoners from NYM to 20 GEO." What is GEO? 21 : It's like a private prison 22 that the Marshals transfer the inmates to when 23 they can't be housed in the BOP. 24 : Okay. And it says, date, 25 Thursday, August 8, 2019 -- EFTA00117085 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 9 1 : Mm-hmm. 2 : -- at 10:33 a.m. And the 3 body of the email, it says, "The following 4 prisoners are to be transferred." 5 Mm-hmm. 6 : And it's two people's 7 name, and the second one says Efrain Reyes. 8 "Please schedule the transfer for Friday, 9 8/9/2019." 10 Mm-hmm. 11 : So, there's that one. 12 : Okay. 13 : And then, there's another 14 email that came out the same day, that says 15 it's from another person with the U.S. Marshal 16 Service, with the last name Elzahr, E-L-Z-A-H- 17 R. And this one was subject, "Prisoner 18 Production On 8/9/2019," and the date was 19 Thursday, August 8th, 2019 at 3:36 p.m., was 20 the email. And one of the attachments was NYM. 21 Is that MCC? 22 : Yes. 23 : All right. Great. And 24 the second, the first two people are the same 25 two people that were listed on this other EFTA00117086 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 10 1 email. And the second person, as you'll see, is 2 Efrain Reyes. It says, "Transfer within," and 3 then, right underneath, it says Judge, MCC, 4 TOT, and then GEO. 5 : Mm-hmm. 6 : What is TOT? 7 : Like, when they transfer them 8 out of the prison. 9 : Okay. So, by looking at 10 this stuff, does this now let you know what was 11 entered pre-removed and why? 12 : Yes. That he was being 13 officially removed out of the institution, 14 going to another destination. 15 : Okay. So, was he ever 16 going to court, based on that? 17 : No. He was going to be 18 transferred to another prison. 19 : Okay. So then, we here 20 at the MCC, then, did know that he was going to 21 another prison, and not coming back to the MCC? 22 : That is correct. 23 : And would you be the 24 person -? So, here's your work schedule. 25 : Mm-hmm. EFTA00117087 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 : I think you couldn't 2 remember at the time. So, on the 8th and the 3 9th, it shows that you were working regular 4 time. 5 : Mm-hmm. 6 : Eight hours. And would 7 you be the one that would have created that 8 court list for the SHU? 9 : For SHU? 10 : Yeah. We were told by 11 your supervisor that you would be the person 12 that would have created that. 13 : 8/9 worked 2:00 to 14 10:00 for Small. Probably. So, I don't 15 recall, but if that was my position that day, 16 then I probably would have created it for the 17 SHU. 18 : Okay. 19 : So, we do it the night 20 before, and send it out the housing units the 21 night before, and they take it up to their 22 units for the next day, for production. 23 : Okay. And then, what is 24 sent and how is it sent? 25 : We just type it in the Sentry EFTA00117088 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 12 1 system. We print out call outs. And the 2 internal officer will disseminate it, and pass 3 it around to the unit officers. 4 : So, the way that the SHU 5 would - you would give it to internal, and then 6 internal would bring it to the SHU? 7 : That is correct. 8 : Okay. And what would the 9 SHU, what would they receive? 10 : They receive a printout of 11 the call out, of whatever this is. This here 12 is people's report (Indiscernible *00:08:22), 13 they print out (Indiscernible *00:08:23) from 14 Sentry. 15 : So, they get a printout 16 of the actual document? 17 : Not this document. A Sentry 18 devised document. 19 : Okay. 20 : We put their names in the 21 Sentry computer system. It prints out a call 22 out receipt, with all the names, the times, and 23 the internal officer would then take it to the 24 housing unit. 25 : Okay. So, based upon EFTA00117089 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 this information that I just showed you 2 : Mm-hmm. 3 : -- what would have you 4 created? What would have it said next to Efrain 5 Reyes' name? 6 : It would say WAB. 7 : Is that it? 8 : That was it. 9 : Okay. So -- 10 : It would say WAB. 11 : -- by it saying WAB, does 12 that mean that he's leaving and he's not 13 returning? 14 : That is correct. 15 : Okay. So, the people 16 that received this in the SHU, in the housing 17 unit that Efrain Reyes was staying in, they 18 would know this guy is leaving and not coming 19 back? 20 : Yes. 21 : Okay. 22 : Well, let me not say they 23 would know. They just know it says WAB. I'm 24 not sure if they know what those acronyms 25 stands for. They just know that he's on a call EFTA00117090 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 out, and that -- 2 : If they know it means -- 3 he has to go down to R&D. 4 : -- if the people, let's 5 say that we know WAB means With All Belongings, 6 and we're supposed to give them everything that 7 they have, and send them on their way. 8 Mm-hmm. That is correct. 9 : Shouldn't they know, at 10 that point, that they're leaving and not coming 11 back? 12 : They should know, yes. 13 : Okay. Great. And since 14 we spoke, were you ever able to find that list 15 that you would have created to provide to the 16 SHU? 17 : We don't keep those. 18 : They don't keep them? Is 19 it ever emailed? 20 : No. 21 : No. So -- 22 : We didn't email those. 23 : -- it's only -- 24 : No. 25 : -- created, printed out, EFTA00117091 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 15 1 and then, you said it's actually created in 2 Sentry, though? 3 : Mm-hmm. 4 : And how long is it 5 maintained in Sentry? 6 : I believe 45 days. 7 : 45 days. So, there is no 8 There would be no way to actually obtain 9 that court list? 10 : I'm not sure. 11 : Okay. But it is called 12 the -. 13 : I don't want to say yeah, and 14 I don't want to say no. I'm not sure. 15 : Okay. But there's no 16 way, that you know of, to obtain that court 17 list? 18 : Right. 19 : And that's what it's 20 called? A court list? Or is it called 21 : A call out. 22 : -- it's called a call out 23 list? 24 : Mm-hmm. 25 : Okay. So, it's not EFTA00117092 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 actually called a court list. 2 : Right. 3 : Okay. Call out list. 4 : Because normally, what we do 5 is, we go back in the night, like, if I have to 6 do a new call list for the next day, I delete 7 the previous call list, because then you'll 8 keep having call lists. So, we go in, we 9 delete it, and we do the next one for the next 10 day. 11 : Okay. Gotcha. 12 : So, I don't even know if 13 they're maintained, how they're maintained in 14 the system. If they're even stored in the 15 system. 16 : Okay. 17 : After that. I don't know. 18 : All right. So, they may 19 only be stored for that 24-hour period, until 20 you do your next list. 21 : Right. 22 : Okay. 23 : Because we're supposed to go 24 in and delete the call out. And then, for the 25 next day, like say, for example, tonight, I EFTA00117093 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 17 1 will be deleting today's call out, and I will 2 be entering tomorrow's call out. 3 : Okay. 4 : So, that's how it's supposed 5 to be done. 6 : Perfect. All right. 7 Great. Do you mind just initialing and dating 8 those -- 9 : Mm-hmm. 10 : -- just so we have them? 11 It's not certifying the accuracy. It's simply 12 saying that that's what you reviewed. 13 : Mm-hmm. 14 : And you can go on, and 15 the date is 8/5/21. 16 : Okay. Okay. Okay. 17 : Thank you. 18 : That's everything. Right? 19 : Thank you so much. All 20 right. So, that covers Efrain Reyes. The next 21 one is going to be with regard to inmate 22 Fernandez. Do you recall us talking to you 23 about an inmate Fernandez? I know you worked in 24 control. 25 : No. EFTA00117094 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 : Oh, that's fine. 2 : We probably talked about it. 3 : We talked about a lot. 4 So, this is just to refresh your memory. It 5 shows that you worked at the MCC on Saturday, 6 August 10th, 2019. This is the daily 7 assignment roster. 8 : Mm-hmm. 9 : It shows that you were 10 control number one. 11 : Mm-hmm. 12 : Working overtime from 13 midnight to 8:00 a.m.? 14 : That is correct. 15 : Is that -? Okay. Great. 16 And then, when you were in control one, are you 17 the only person in control, at that time? 18 : No. 19 : Okay. 20 : I have a control two. Okay. 21 Wait a minute. 22 : And I'll -. 23 : I know was there with 24 me. 25 : So, internal would be EFTA00117095 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 actually with you? 2 : That number two was - would 3 be in control with me. 4 : Okay. So, that's how it 5 went. Okay. 6 : At that time, the number two. 7 They normally they didn't have an internal 8 number two, but that person is the person that 9 was in there with me because, at that time, 10 when they would put the internal number two on 11 the roster, they would be the person that would 12 assist the control center officer, in the 13 control. And they would do the counts, and 14 assignments, and do the - yeah - the counts. 15 The call outs. If somebody was on suicide 16 watch, and they had a companion swap out to 17 come out to a work detail, they would take that 18 companion off, put that new companion on, while 19 food service came and they would key in the 20 food service workers that would be off the 21 housing unit, but at that time, we only have -. 22 If we had anybody, it would be him. 23 : Okay. 24 : Yes. Yes. 25 : So - and you probably EFTA00117096 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 20 1 told me this before, then - so, would be 2 the one responsible for doing the counts, as 3 : Yes. 4 : -- as the second. And 5 what would your responsibility be? 6 : My responsibility was 7 ensuring all the equipment was in the control 8 center, doing a body alarm testing. What else? 9 Tracking all the equipment. Doing the 10 paperwork as far as the security forms, 11 (Indiscernible *00:13:37) security forms. And 12 looking up at cameras periodically. Popping 13 the doors. 14 : Okay. But nothing to do 15 with counts? 16 : No. 17 : Okay. Then this might 18 not be too relevant. All right. As far as the 19 last person we talked about during our last 20 interview was Fernandez, and we've since 21 learned, through our reviews, that Fernandez 22 was gone from the SHU around 1:40 p.m., and 23 definitely moved to R&D at least by 3:15. 24 : Oh, I recall that. 25 : Yeah. EFTA00117097 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 : Okay. 2 : Okay. 3 : I recall. Yes. 4 : So, were you able to -? 5 : I didn't recall his name. 6 : I think you may have led 7 us onto this. I can't exactly remember. But 8 there's the inmate history quarters for inmate 9 Fernandez. 10 Mm-hmm. 11 : And it shows that he was 12 in the SHU, put to the SHU on August 2nd, 2019, 13 and then, he was not keyed out of the SHU, and 14 put into his RO1. Does that stand for R&D? 15 : Mm-hmm. 16 : Okay. Until 8/10/2019, 17 at 12:35 a.m., on August 10th, 2019. Would 18 that have -. Would you be involved in that at 19 all? 20 : No. 21 : No? So, not with what you 22 were doing? 23 Hmm-mm. 24 : Who has the ability to 25 key people in and out of the housing units. EFTA00117098 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 Does -? 2 : I mean, the control center 3 officers have the ability to do it. The 4 lieutenants, if they know. They have the 5 ability to do it. The SHU officers have the 6 ability to do it. And R&D has the ability to 7 do to it. 8 : Okay. So, there's 9 actually a number of people that could have 10 done that. 11 : Yeah. 12 : Okay. But that's not 13 something you would have done in your role? 14 : No. Hmm-mm. 15 : And you don't recall 16 doing that? 17 : No. 18 : Okay. Great. Do you 19 mind just -. And you're there -. Actually, 20 just initial and date these (Indiscernible 21 *00:15:19). 22 : Mm-hmm. 23 : So, in your expert 24 opinion, at that time, 12:35 a.m., who would 25 have been the one, then -- EFTA00117099 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 2 : Well -- : -- do you think, who 3 would have -? 4 : -- that would be the number 5 two person because he's -- 6 : If they did it from 7 control. 8 right. Right. But if he 9 did it from control, because he would be 10 preparing the counts. Or it could have been 11 the SHU officer. I don't know. 12 : Okay. 13 : It could have been a number 14 of people. 15 : Or it could have been the 16 Ops Lieutenant. Correct? 17 : Right. 18 : Okay. But it wasn't you? 19 : But normally, the Ops 20 Lieutenants, they don't do that. It's normally 21 the control, or the SHU officer. What is 22 today? The fifth? 23 : And that's who would 24 normally do it? When an inmate is moved, it 25 would typically be control -- EFTA00117100 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 : Control. 2 : -- or the housing unit 3 officers? 4 : No. Not the housing unit 5 officer. 6 : Just the SHU? 7 : It would be the control. 8 : Oh, so, typically, it's 9 control? 10 : Control. 11 : So, if -. 12 : But if he's moving from an 13 area within SHU, like say one SHU bed to 14 another SHU bed, the SHU OIC would be making 15 the changes in the system, but this is one 16 location to another location. Like, physically 17 out of that unit. That probably, most likely, 18 at that time, and it might have been the 19 control. 20 : Well, so, in this case, 21 that's not when he was moved. That's just when 22 it was caught. So, we believe that actually -- 23 : Right. 24 : -- the Ops Lieutenant did 25 that, because she's the one who figured it out. EFTA00117101 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 25 1 However, it sounds like, when he was moved at 2 approximately 3:00 p.m. the day before, August 3 9th, 2019, control should have been the one 4 : Mm-hmm. 5 : -- to do it. Is that 6 correct? 7 : Wait a minute. 8 : So, if he -- 9 : Repeat that again. 10 : -- if he went from - at 11 about 3:00 p.m., he was moved from the SHU, 12 that was his housing unit, and placed into R&D 13 as his new housing unit -- 14 : Right. 15 : -- and placed on dry 16 cell, with staff assigned to him, who should 17 have -? 18 : Control should have. The SHU 19 officer should have notified control, or 20 whoever was moving him, and put him there, 21 should have notified control this inmate moved 22 from so and so place, and is now placed here, 23 and the control center officer should have been 24 keying him at that location. 25 : So, the control should EFTA00117102 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 have done it? 2 : Mm-hmm. 3 : Perfect. Thank you. 4 MR. : If the officer who actually 5 moved him actually wrote up a shot, also, for 6 moving him? Because if -- 7 : Say that again. 8 MR. : DO you know what a shot is? 9 Mm-hmm. An incident report. 10 MR. : Incident report. Does that 11 mean that the officer was responsible for - 12 to make sure that the control was aware that 13 inmate was being moved? 14 : Well, whenever an inmate is 15 leaving your housing unit, going off your unit 16 completely, you should be notifying control, 17 and verifying your base count and your unit 18 count. So, that's what you should be doing. 19 : Well, what about in this 20 case? If the person was actually in visiting, 21 and the reason why he got the shot was because 22 the person that was visiting him provided him 23 contraband. From there, they took him 24 : Well, the unit officer might 25 not necessarily know that, because somebody EFTA00117103 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 27 1 would have to tell that unit officer this 2 person is being removed, going to SHU, because 3 they got drugs on the visiting floor. So, the 4 unit officer might not necessarily know that, 5 but -. 6 : Well, let's say, in this 7 case, for instance, it was. It was actually 8 the person who found him, was the OIC of the 9 SHU, he's the one who saw what happened, and -- 10 : Mm-hmm. 11 : -- actually is the one 12 who placed him onto the dry cell, and is the 13 one that wrote up the shot. 14 : Oh, okay. Well then, he 15 should have just ben notifying control he's 16 going to dry cell. If it was dry cell within 17 the SHU, then he doesn't -- 18 : It was dry cell in R&D. 19 right, but if it was in 20 SHU, he wouldn't have to notify nobody because 21 it's in SHU. 22 : Right. 23 : He would just make the bed 24 assignment change, but because he actually 25 physically left the unit, he should have been EFTA00117104 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 28 1 notifying the control center, I got one being 2 moved from SHU down to R&D for dry cell. 3 : Okay. So, he should have 4 notified control and said, key this person into 5 6 : Mm-hmm. 7 : -- to R&D? Okay. 8 : Not just specifically him, 9 but anybody that was in the SHU working that 10 day should have just notified. It's not, you 11 know, because we all share the same 12 responsibility. 13 : Okay. Perfect. Do you 14 mind just initialing and dating that 15 : Mm-hmm. 16 -- then, the last 17 MR. : I'm sorry. I have a quick 18 question on the same thing. 19 : Sure. 20 MR. : How soon after you move an 21 inmate should that update be done? 22 : Immediately. 23 MR. : Why? 24 : Because if you got to do an 25 emergency count, you've got to account for EFTA00117105 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 29 1 where that person is. 2 MR. : Now, let's say, if it wasn't 3 done immediately, what could happen to the 4 count? 5 : We have a bad count. 6 : Here you go. Keep those 7 together. Keep it in order. And then, the 8 last thing, I think -. Well, no, because 9 there's, like, two more. This one was the - 10 and you just said, would have been the one 11 responsible for the -- 12 : Mm-hmm. 13 : -- the count. Correct? 14 : Mm-hmm. 15 : So, and I think we talked 16 about this already. 17 : Mm-hmm. 18 : But if you see, this is 19 the count from 8/10/2019, it says it was 20 printed at 12:35, I guess, and then, it shows 21 , and I think this is 22 signature, as well. Right above . It 23 says, "Good verbal" at 12:36 a.m. Count 24 cleared at 12:49 p.m. ZA, it says 72. RA, it 25 says one. However, and again, I think - which EFTA00117106 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 we already discussed in our last one 2 according to the ZA count slips, on the very 3 last page, it says 73. 4 : Mm-hmm. 5 : And it shows, M. Thomas 6 and Noel are the ones that signed it. 7 : Mm-hmm. 8 : And it shows they signed 9 it at 12:01 a.m. And do you have any knowledge 10 or recollection of this being a bad count? 11 Being that the El says 72, and the count slip 12 said that, it said 73. And you don't -- 13 : No. 14 : -- no? 15 : Because normally, when 16 they're take - that's, like, the beginning of 17 the shift. So, normally, while they're taking 18 count, I'm in there, verifying keys, making 19 sure equipment is there, radios is there, 20 checking all - everything else. So, while 21 they're taking the count. So, I'm not 22 necessarily sitting right there, alongside 23 them, listening to what's going on. 24 : Okay. 25 : You know? So, no. EFTA00117107 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 31 1 : And if the Ops Lieutenant 2 was at this time, I believe 3 that's her signature on top of . If she's 4 taking that official count, where would that 5 count be -? Where would she be taking the 6 count? 7 : In the control center, 8 alongside the counting assignment Office, 9 alongside 10 : Okay. And do you recall 11 that taking place that night, by chance? 12 : If the roster said she was 13 there, then she probably was there, but I don't 14 recall. I don't. 15 : Okay. But in order for 16 her to sign it, and for him to -- 17 : She would have to be there. 18 : -- all right. And do you 19 know - this is pretty nice handwriting - do you 20 know if that would be handwriting, or 21 hers? Can you really tell by that? 22 : I know this is . I 23 don't know whose writing this is. 24 : Okay. But that is 25 EFTA00117108 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 2 32 This is his right here, yeah. : Okay. Perfect. And you 3 don't And do you recall ever 4 getting on the phone, though, with the SHU, 5 regarding this count? 6 : No. 7 : No. That's fine. Do you 8 mind just initialing -- 9 : Mm-hmm. 10 : -- and dating it. 11 : Now, that, I don't. Are you 12 taking this? Okay. 13 : And then, this. Can you 14 just explain to us what we're looking at here? 15 What is this document? 16 : Okay. This is an, on the 17 evening watch shift, the control center, the 18 control number one person is responsible for 19 accounting for all the keys. So, you go 20 through every key, count the keys, make sure Al 21 has 17 keys. And that's what this is. So, 22 each key, you're accounting for the amount of 23 keys on the keyring. So, that's what this is. 24 : Okay. So, when people go 25 in and out of the institution, they get keys. EFTA00117109 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 33 1 Is that what it is? 2 : No. At the end of the night, 3 at the end of the night, on the evening shift, 4 you got to account for all the equipment, and 5 that's the - to make sure those keys are there, 6 and that those keys have this many -. Let me 7 not say that, like that. Account for all the 8 keys on the keyring. The keyring might say Al, 9 five keys. So, there's a chit on the keyring 10 that says five. So, you have to make sure five 11 keys is on that keyring. 12 : Okay. So, it's kind of, 13 like, it's for equipment, though? Not for 14 people? 15 : No. That's for equipment. 16 : Okay. And is there also 17 one, though, for people? 18 : There's one for people. To 19 make sure who's on duty? 20 : Yeah. So, like, I've 21 been in other institutions where they have 22 these, you know, the little rings that, if they 23 go in or out of the institution, they grab 24 their chip, or they put it back on -- 25 : It's a chit board. We have a EFTA00117110 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 chit board here. 2 : -- okay. So, that's not 3 this, though? 4 : No. 5 : This has to do 6 specifically with equipment, if you take a 7 piece of equipment, then you take the chip to 8 go with it? 9 : No. That has to do 10 specifically, with accountability for keys. 11 Meaning, Al has 18 keys. So, if the chit on 12 the keyring says 18, you're supposed to have 18 13 keys. So, if lock shop came and changed the 14 keys, and took one key off or added a key, that 15 key count would be different. It would be 16 another number for that key. So, you're 17 verifying. That's basically just verification 18 and accountability that this is how ever many 19 keys we have on that keyring. 20 : Okay. So, this is just 21 showing what keys, and if they're actual keys, 22 and the accountability of those keys. 23 : Right. And how many keys is 24 on that ring. 25 : All right. That was your EFTA00117111 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 35 1 question. Did you want anything more on that? 2 MR. : With this show any keys 3 belonging to the SHU? And let's say if the 4 count was off, would it be reflected was off, 5 would it be reflected in there? 6 : No. 7 MR. : (Indiscernible *00:24:40) 8 manner? 9 : Would this have anything 10 to do with the count? 11 : This doesn't have anything to 12 do with the count. This is just equipment. 13 MR. : No, no. I mean, the count 14 for the keys, the number of keys. And let's 15 say the number of keys on that ring, and 16 (Indiscernible *00:24:51) -. 17 : No, because what the control 18 center officer does is, on the evening watch 19 shift, whatever keys is not in the control 20 center, he'll call up to the unit as he's doing 21 - as he's testing body alarms, he'll say, what 22 keys do you have? You'll say, oh, I have 23 Charlie nine, and with what. And he'll tell 24 you, you'll say, I have Charlie nine with five 25 or whatever amount of keys you have, and he'll EFTA00117112 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 36 1 write that down. And then, the lieutenant will 2 go over this at night, and verify the key count 3 is accurate. 4 MR. : Is there a count in there for 5 the SHU keys? 6 : Well, this isn't the 7 count. It's not 8/10. 8 MR. : Yeah. 9 : Mm-hmm. 10 MR. : I just want to know if there 11 is specifically addresses SHU keys, that's all. 12 : Okay. 13 : This is the whole 14 institution's keys. So, yeah. SHU keys would 15 be here, too. Yes. 16 : What would they be listed 17 under? 18 : The Charlie keys. 19 MR. : Do you know which Charlies? 20 : Hmm. 21 : So, the C's? 22 : The C keys. So, I think, 23 starting, if I don't -. If I recall. I think 24 they start at -- 25 MR. : If you don't know -- EFTA00117113 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 37 1 : -- they're Charlie and the 2 Bravos. Because it's - I think it starts at 3 Charlie. What is it? I don't remember. I just 4 know the keys when I'm in the control center. 5 MR. : Okay. 6 : I can't tell you off the top 7 of my head by looking, but I know it's the 8 Charlie keys, and the Bravo keys. Because one 9 is a cuff key, and one is a cell door key. 10 MR. : Can you initial and date 11 that? 12 : Mm-hmm. 13 : (Indiscernible *00:26:19) 14 question (Indiscernible *00:26:19)? 15 MR. : No. 16 : Okay. 17 : Yeah. But - yeah - this 18 doesn't tell you who had the keys. It just 19 tells you -. 20 MR. : Is there a way to identify 21 who signed out the keys, or anything like that? 22 : No, because everybody puts 23 their chits on it. We don't sign out keys. 24 MR. : Okay. 25 : Nobody signs out keys. EFTA00117114 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 38 1 MR. : It's a chit. Okay. 2 : It's a chit system. That's 3 how you know who has what equipment. 4 : So, when you take a key, 5 you leave your chit? 6 : Yes. 7 : How do you spell chit? 8 : C-H-I-T. 9 : Okay. Why they don't 10 just call it a chip. It's so much easier. 11 Mm-hmm. Yeah. A chit. 12 Yeah. So, it's like a barter system. Like, I 13 give you this, you give me that. 14 : Okay. 15 : And then, at the end of the 16 night, you're giving the keys, you get your 17 chits back. So, that's what that's for. 18 : Does everybody have a 19 certain amount of chits? 20 : Everybody gets six chits. If 21 you lose a chit, you can always go and get more 22 chits. Or if you don't have chits, and lock 23 shop is not here, go to the lieutenant's 24 office, you get some temp chits. And then, 25 you'll use those chits at -. And then, when EFTA00117115 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 39 1 you're done with your shift, you return the 2 temp chits back to the lieutenant's office, but 3 everybody -. It depends on if you come from 4 another institution, you already come with 5 extra chits on you -- 6 : Right. 7 : -- because you got those from 8 your previous institution. So, everybody 9 doesn't have the same amount of chits. 10 : And does it say your name 11 on it? 12 : Yeah. 13 : Okay. 14 : Mm-hmm. 15 : So, if you have to borrow 16 one, what does that say? 17 : If you have to borrow a chit? 18 : Yeah. If you forgot them 19 or something, and you've got to go and get one 20 to use. 21 : The temp chit says temp on 22 it. 23 : Temp. Okay. 24 : It says T-E-M-P. It looks 25 like this. I'm going to pull it off my ring. EFTA00117116 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 40 1 They look like this. 2 : Oh, okay. Cool. So, it 3 says S. on there. 4 : Mm-hmm. 5 : Perfect. 6 : So, each institution does it 7 different. But some of them are square, some 8 of them are circle. Some of them are octagon 9 shaped. Just depends on however your 10 institution cuts them out. 11 : Okay. Cool. 12 : But that's 13 : Thank you. 14 : -- a chit. 15 MR. : And this count happens only 16 once a day, on the evening watch? 17 Mm-hmm. Yup. 18 : At what time? 19 : Normally, they do it when 20 they come in. On the evening shift, when 21 they're doing the count. So, like, for, like, 22 at that time, we was on three shifts. So, the 23 evening shift would do this, anywhere between 24 4:00, 6:00. 25 : So, this document you EFTA00117117 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 were looking at, would have been somewhere 2 between 4:00 and 6:00 on 8/9/2021. The next 3 one wouldn't be done until -- 4 : Because they have up until -- 5 : -- (Indiscernible 6 *00:28:42). 7 : -- the end of their shift to 8 turn this in. 9 : Sure. 10 : So, most of the times, if you 11 have officers on the unit, it's feasible to 12 take the key count when you're doing your body 13 alarm testing of the unit officers, and 14 verifying that officers on duty asking who's on 15 shift, so you can write their name for that 16 post. So, it's always easy to do it at that 17 time. So, normally, for the officers, this 18 would take place during, when their body alarm 19 is being tested. And that's normally at the 20 start of your shift, that you test your body 21 alarm, when you come in the institution. 22 That's -- 23 : Cool. 24 : -- primarily. 25 MR. : The last question. If there EFTA00117118 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 was -- 2 : Mm-hmm. 3 MR. -- happened to be a set of 4 keys missing, is that recorded anywhere? 5 : If you write it in a logbook, 6 and you notify the lieutenant, but if it's 7 missing, and it can't be found, then yeah, it 8 gets written down. But if it's missing and 9 it's located, and it's returned, then it's not 10 really missing because it's, oh, I, you know, 11 if you say - prime example - you'll say inmate 12 so and so chit is here, but you know so and so 13 is gone, and those chits should have been back. 14 You might call them and say, hey, do you have 15 keys, so and so? And they'll say, oh, yeah, and 16 then, they'll turn around, because you're 17 supposed to turn around immediately and bring 18 the keys back to the institution. 19 : Okay. 20 : If you happen to go home with 21 it in your pocket, or on your belt, or 22 something. 23 : Okay. 24 : Or still on your waist. Or 25 you just forgot to just transfer over the keys EFTA00117119 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 43 1 to the relieving officer. That has happened. 2 If somebody went home, you know, left out the 3 institution with the keys on, and just didn't 4 think to give it to the officer, by accident. 5 And had to come back and bring the keys back. 6 So, yeah. 7 : But in this case, you 8 couldn't get, like, the key to, like, actually 9 get in and out of the SHU. Correct? Because 10 that inner door, that's not on that board. 11 Correct? 12 : Hmm-mm. Nobody just pops a 13 key, uses a key to get in SHU. Nobody - 14 everything is always by the control center, in 15 order to get into SHU - nobody can just walk up 16 to SHU with a key and go in and out. 17 : Right. 18 : No. 19 : So, would these keys, 20 when you said there's these keys, there's some 21 SHU on there, with the Charlie -- 22 : Mm-hmm. 23 : -- what are you 24 : The Charlie keys. 25 : -- what are you referring EFTA00117120 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 44 1 to? Is that, like, the cell keys? 2 : These are - yeah, that's what 3 I had said - these are cell door keys. 4 : Okay. 5 : Cell door keys, and handcuff 6 keys. Restraint keys. 7 : Okay. 8 : Yeah. 9 : Cool. 10 Mm-hmm. Yeah. No one gets a 11 door key. The only door key is the inner door. 12 That's it. 13 : Right. And because the 14 control has to pop the door on the outer door? 15 : Yup. 16 : Okay. 17 : Mm-hmm. 18 MR. : And do you guys sign in and 19 out with the inner door keys? 20 : The inner door keys? 21 MR. : Yeah. 22 : The chits. 23 : But not -- 24 : You don't sign it. 25 : -- there's no SHU inner EFTA00117121 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 1 door key that you can sign in and out of. 2 : No. 3 : Correct? No? 4 : No. 5 : Okay. 6 : No. 7 : Okay. So, that's not 8 even listed on that document? 9 : No. 10 : Great. 11 MR. : Okay. 12 : No. 13 : Well, thank you very 14 much. 15 : You're welcome. 16 : Anything else? 17 MR. : I'm good. Thank you. 18 : Anything else that you 19 could think of, since the last time we spoke, 20 that we should know about? 21 Hmm. No. No. 22 : All right. Well, we 23 can't thank you enough. You're always -- 24 : Oh, you're welcome, guys. 25 : -- a pleasure. EFTA00117122 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 46 1 : All the time. 2 : And it is 2:21 p.m. This 3 is Senior Special Agent and 4 I'm turning off the recorder. 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 EFTA00117123 LIMITED OFFICIAL USE 47 1 CERTIFICATE 2 I hereby certify that the foregoing pages 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 represent an accurate transcript of the electronic sound recording of the proceedings before the Department of Justice, Office of the Inspector General in the matter of: Interview of Brianna Rose Burton, Transcriber EFTA00117124